What is the definiton of rich? Cancel The title field is required!

1. McCallum David K

   
   5/22/2012 11:05 AM

   A year or two ago, maybe 3 even, time flies when you're having fun right, our president set the aribitrary number of $250,000 as being rich. Think this may have come during a debate with Joe the plumber or someone like him. Now it appears in the great state of Maryland and their democatic governor Martin O'Malley along with the democratic legislature has now redefined rich as $100,000 for an individual and $150,000 for a couple filling jointly. I had no idea that the cost of living was that cheap in Maryland that 150k was considered rich. Do you think in the long run this may be detrimental to both individuals and business that currerntly reside and operate in Maryland? Don't see how it can do anything but. Please don't tell my wife she'll want to move to Maryland.................we're on the verge of being rich and did't know it. At some point the number will be 75k and on and on..............

   
   
   
   
2. Robert Crockett

   

   4 posts
   
   5/22/2012 12:05 PM

   So.........................The more money this administration wants.......the more wealthy we become?
   Invest in gold I say
   
   
   A Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years prior:
   
   "A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government.
   A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury.
   From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse over loose fiscal policy, (which is) always followed by a dictatorship."
   
   "The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years.
   During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence:
   
   From bondage to spiritual faith;
   From spiritual faith to great courage;
   From courage to liberty;
   From liberty to abundance;
   From abundance to complacency;
   From complacency to apathy;
   From apathy to dependence;
   From dependence back into bondage."
   The Obituary follows:
   
   Born 1776, Died 2012
   It doesn't hurt to read this several times.
   
   Professor Joseph Olson of Hamline University School of Law in
   St. Paul, Minnesota, points out some interesting [size=150">[u">facts[/u">[/size"> concerning the last Presidential election:
   
   Number of States won by: Obama: 19 McCain: 29
   Square miles of land won by: Obama: 580,000 McCain: 2,427,000
   Population of counties won by: Obama: 127 million McCain: 143 million.
   
   Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by: Obama:13.2 McCain: 2.1
   
   Professor Olson adds: "In aggregate, the map of the territory McCain won was mostly the land owned
   by the taxpaying citizens of the country.
   
   Obama territory mostly encompassed those citizens living in low income tenements and living off various forms of government welfare..."
   In 2008 Obama beat McCain in the Electoral College by 365 votes to 173.
   
   Olson believes the United States is now somewhere between the "complacency and apathy" phase of Professor Tyler's definition of democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's population already
   having reached the "governmental dependency" phase.
   
   If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million criminal invaders called illegal's -
   and they vote
   - then we can say goodbye to the USA in fewer than five years.

   
   
   
   
3. Keith Pegg

   

   0 posts
   
   5/22/2012 5:05 PM

   David, what a great question,
   
   Rich:
   1. having wealth or great possessions; abundantly supplied with resources, means, or funds; wealthy: a rich man; a rich nation.
   2. abounding in natural resources: a rich territory.
   3. having wealth or valuable resources (usually followed by in ): a country rich in traditions.
   4. abounding (usually followed by in or with ): a countryside rich in beauty; a design rich with colors.
   5. of great value or worth; valuable: a rich harvest.
   
   From Wikipedia:
   Many politicians, heirs to fortunes, top business executives, CEOs, successful venture capitalists and celebrities are considered members of this class. Some prominent and high-rung professionals may also be included if they attain great influence and wealth. The main distinguishing feature of this class, which is estimated to constitute roughly 1% of the population, is the source of income. While the vast majority of persons and households derive their income from salaries, those in the upper class derive their income from investments and capital gains. Estimates for the size of this group commonly vary from 1% to 2%, while some surveys have indicated that as many as 6% of Americans identify as "upper class." Sociologist Leonard Beeghley sees wealth as the only significant distinguishing feature of this class and, therefore, refers to this group simply as "the rich."
   
   From Me:
   Try as I might I could find correlations between B Obama and J McCain and Rich people the 1%-2% completely turning the 98% of the population to the President Obama side of the election.
   Now if we drop the definition of "Rich" down to say $500,000 in Assets, I still could not find any major influence that the one party was that much stronger in the election. I did reread the pole stats and president Obama won by a good popular vote margin. Unlike the election of Mr. Kerry and few years ago who did win by popular vote but still lost; …never will understand that one.
   After doing some reading on money and Rich I did check my own wealth and maybe I am "rich". In some people's minds I am, but I still only have one vote. Maybe that is not fair I have more than many so my vote should count more, would you all agree? That 18 year old with his (or her) whippersnapper vote and no money or property should not get the say in an election that I get. Of course on that line of thinking Mr. Gates has more than me so his vote is worth even more. I am not sure I am okay with that?
   Then I remembered America is not a dictator style government. But a people's democratic government, so the last election was fair, we are a lucky people.
   
   Keith Pegg
   Working for the US Government
   Japan,

   
   
   
   
4. McCallum David K

   
   5/23/2012 6:05 AM

   Bob investing in gold requires lots of cash...............
   
   Keith......good comments and points. It is hard for me to fathom though the thought process of the Maryland legislature to pick the number they. I do not know what percentage of American's fall into that 100k to 150k (jointly) category. My wife and I do but certainly do not consider myself rich by any means. I live comfortably like many guys my age becasue I owe no one anything. Home, autos etc paid for. If and when I buy another car it will be a 100% cash purchase. A family of 4 or 5 making 150k is not close to being rich and working hard to make ends meet most likely. An American family now, if you have children to raise and educate, your abilty to save for the future or even a rainy day is greatly curtailed by the taxes we all pay. I don't worry that much about myself but I think a lot about my son and granddaugthers future 20-25 yrs from now. I hope I have invested well enough to provide for a wife that may outlive me by 20-30 years and she has something left to pass on. I'd give it away on a street corner before leaving it for the government to waste or to give to leeches.

   
   
   
   
5. Wahlin Scott B

   
   5/23/2012 6:05 PM

   I read on a Fox News Wire that Maryland has determined that singles who make between $100M and $150M are rich because the govt is going to raise their tax rate in that bracket by 0.25%. That is a 0.0025x increase or $125 per year. That is going to kill all of the job creators in Maryland and increase the distribution of condoms to fourth graders. Just saying...

   
   
   
   
6. Bowden Max

   
   5/24/2012 5:05 AM

   DMac,
   
   The left will not be happy until the rich line and poverty line meet.
   
   MM

   
   
   
   
7. Wahlin Scott B

   
   5/24/2012 6:05 AM

   Max Bowden said: DMac,
   
   The left will not be happy until the rich line and poverty line meet.
   
   MM

   
   
   DMC, (cause I am not talking to MM)
   
   It is funny how the views of the right and left mirror each other. From my point of view this could not be further from the truth. The left (and everyone who understands how American business works) wants to maintain the middle class and thus a large gap between rich and poverty, while the right has disdain for the middle class and wants them to be eliminated thus no gap between the plantation owners and their slaves.
   
   You are going to get your panties in a wad over $125 per year to someone making $150,000 and you expect anyone other than a tea partying radical to take you seriously?

   
   
   
   
8. Robert Crockett

   

   4 posts
   
   5/24/2012 6:05 AM

   David McCallum said: Bob investing in gold requires lots of cash...............
   
   Keith......good comments and points. It is hard for me to fathom though the thought process of the Maryland legislature to pick the number they. I do not know what percentage of American's fall into that 100k to 150k (jointly) category. My wife and I do but certainly do not consider myself rich by any means. I live comfortably like many guys my age becasue I owe no one anything. Home, autos etc paid for. If and when I buy another car it will be a 100% cash purchase. A family of 4 or 5 making 150k is not close to being rich and working hard to make ends meet most likely. An American family now, if you have children to raise and educate, your abilty to save for the future or even a rainy day is greatly curtailed by the taxes we all pay. I don't worry that much about myself but I think a lot about my son and granddaugthers future 20-25 yrs from now. I hope I have invested well enough to provide for a wife that may outlive me by 20-30 years and she has something left to pass on. I'd give it away on a street corner before leaving it for the government to waste or to give to leeches.

   
   21.8 percent of familys in the US make over 100000 dollars a year and 6-7% of individuals make 100000 a year
   
   Bob investing in gold requires lots of cash............... Not exactly Dave.......................

   
   
   
   
9. Peter Bowman

   

   11 posts
   
   5/24/2012 7:05 AM

   Scott Wahlin, CGCS"] [
   
   while the right has disdain for the middle class and wants them to be eliminated thus no gap between the plantation owners and their slaves.
   
   quote]
   
   Where do you get that crap, Scott? My God, you actually believe that.

   
   
   
   
10. Wahlin Scott B

    
    5/24/2012 7:05 AM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbExyurUWvQ

    
    
    
    
11. McCallum David K

    
    5/24/2012 8:05 AM

    Ahhhhhhhhh I knew there had to be a video somewhere.........it's like a crack addiction to you......cannot express an opinion without some You Tube video. I personally never owned any slaves nor have any of my prior family members that preceeded me on this earth . At least as far back as I have researched the family tree. Perhaps though some of my Scottish ancestors owned a few rubber plantation in Africa that I am not aware of. And for a guy that is so adamant about gay marriage rights the "panties in a wad" comment might best be suited for you............I wear drawers.

    
    
    
    
12. Peter Bowman

    

    11 posts
    
    5/24/2012 8:05 AM

    David McCallum said: Ahhhhhhhhh I knew there had to be a video somewhere.........it's like a crack addiction to you......cannot express an opinion without some You Tube video.

    
    
    
    No way, DMac. Scott did all his video reasearch in the 11 minutes between my reply and his youtube video posting. It's not like he was sitting there at his computer, video already loaded and ready to go, just waiting for a reply like mine so he could click Submit.

    
    
    
    
13. Wahlin Scott B

    
    5/24/2012 8:05 AM

    David McCallum said: Ahhhhhhhhh I knew there had to be a video somewhere.........it's like a crack addiction to you......cannot express an opinion without some You Tube video. I personally never owned any slaves nor have any of my prior family members that preceeded me on this earth . At least as far back as I have researched the family tree. Perhaps though some of my Scottish ancestors owned a few rubber plantation in Africa that I am not aware of. And for a guy that is so adamant about gay marriage rights the "panties in a wad" comment might best be suited for you............I wear drawers.

    
    
    $125 per year to stabilize the economy for someone making $150,000, maybe I should say you should not get your diapers in a wad.
    
    PS: If the crack comments continue I will go back to pointing out racist remarks.

    
    
    
    
14. Wahlin Scott B

    
    5/24/2012 8:05 AM

    And what better way...................... to point out the nastiness and hatefulness................... of your people and your point of view.................. than a video............. caught in the act.
    
    ............................. That is what Americans need, to be divided and conquered by the rich.

    
    
    
    
15. McCallum David K

    
    5/24/2012 1:05 PM

    Yes I must admit to at one point wearing diapers and as I get older may yet again.........but never panties Scott.
    Ok just a behavioral addiction my bad............no foreign substances, legal or otherwise, needed.
    
    PS....... go read the mayo and 2 beer post and take something from it..........nothing you say on here to me is going to change one single thing in this country......my vote cancels your vote and visa versa...........like I tell Mel often, get outside, ride a bike, take a boat ride, play some golf, smell the roses.........the TV, talk radio and you tube obessions is not healthy.
    
    PS Petey I don't know if you had anything to do with this but somehow I am now on a Obama spam list and get hit daily inviting me to donate and come visit with rich and famous.............where's Timmy at........I think I'm being watched.

    
    
    
    
16. Dennis Cook

    

    1 posts
    
    5/24/2012 2:05 PM

    Scott Wahlin, CGCS said:

    Max Bowden said: DMac,
    
    The left will not be happy until the rich line and poverty line meet.
    
    MM

    
    
    DMC, (cause I am not talking to MM)
    
    It is funny how the views of the right and left mirror each other. From my point of view this could not be further from the truth. The left (and everyone who understands how American business works) wants to maintain the middle class and thus a large gap between rich and poverty, while the right has disdain for the middle class and wants them to be eliminated thus no gap between the plantation owners and their slaves.
    
    You are going to get your panties in a wad over $125 per year to someone making $150,000 and you expect anyone other than a tea partying radical to take you seriously?

    
    
    How the heck can you maintain a middle class, without them working for someone who has some money? So apparently the left knows nothing about how american business works. To you Scott, the business is there to provide jobs and insurance and pay taxes. But in reality, the business is there to make a profit and provide a product or service to the consumer. They do that by having employees that they pay to help provide their vision. The employee agrees to work for a wage and help the business become sucessful. If the businesses make no profit, there would be no middle class....There would also be no upper class, just a lot of people in poverty. So you obviously do not understand american business, they dont exist for the employee. And if you dont like that, then start your own business and see how long you last if your goal is to employ people and not make a profit. Then you can say you lefties have a little better grasp on American business.

    
    
    
    
17. Melvin Waldron

    

    43 posts
    
    5/25/2012 3:05 PM

    Quick question for you David, is Maryland's legislation for taxing salaries defined as "Rich" or is that the number they picked out? Is the term "rich" in the legislation? Sometimes I think we get hung up on a term and a number. I agree with you as to how does one go about picking out a number to break up the tax brackets? Maybe I will tell by boss, "excuse me sir, instead of that 3% raise to $150,000 from $146,000, could you only give me a 2% raise? And next year instead of a raise, could I get 3 extra days of vacation?" That would stop me from becoming "rich" and going into another tax bracket?
    
    Dennis I can see your point about people who own businesses needing money to hire and support people, in turn they need to have some profit, to reinvest. But don't underestimate the need for having a middle class that has some purchasing power to help businesses, if people don't have money to spend, how does that help businesses? I think they need to go hand in hand. Of course we are painting all business with a broad brush, there are needs and then there is discretionary income, if your business is providing a need, your in better shape. And us liberals are crying class warfare? You are talking about protecting one over another. I will admit there are some on the left that are doing the same thing. There needs to be someplace in the middle where everyone benefits.
    
    I do have a question as to business owners and job providers, say a plumbing contractor does well. Now, I suppose they pay themselves a salary, and then they can distribute any profits they make back to themselves, or they invests it back into to the business for new equipment, or even investing in their employees, thus avoiding some taxes. Then there are those that basically live off investments, capital gains, and such, not really providing a service or product, (well if it's investment capital, I can see that as a service and product, so they are the same). My question is, why should that income be taxed differently? (maybe this should be another topic?)
    
    Mel

    
    Melvin H. Waldron III, CGCS, Horton Smith Golf Course, City of Springfield/Greene County MO
    
    
18. Clay Putnam

    

    33 posts
    
    5/25/2012 5:05 PM

    Among other reasons, capital gains income is taxed at a lower rate to entice investors to recirculate money through the system. If capital gains were at a higher tax rate then the investor would not sell their shares as often thus "locking up" capital.
    
    Capital gains has historically been taxed at a lower rate.

    
    
    
    
19. Peter Bowman

    

    11 posts
    
    5/25/2012 9:05 PM

    Rich, to a Liberal: "You make more than me. That's not fair."
    
    Rich, to a Conservative: "Thank you for the job you are providing me."

    
    
    
    
20. Melvin Waldron

    

    43 posts
    
    5/25/2012 11:05 PM

    Clay Putnam, CGCS said: Among other reasons, capital gains income is taxed at a lower rate to entice investors to recirculate money through the system. If capital gains were at a higher tax rate then the investor would not sell their shares as often thus "locking up" capital.
    
    Capital gains has historically been taxed at a lower rate.

    
    
    That makes some sense to me, but as I have said before, if those people want to make money, I think they are going to invest, no matter what tax they would pay on their gains, just like someone is not going to turn down a raise. I guess there are those that would say I have enough and screw the government I'm not to give them anymore, but I feel the majority of people are not going to turn more money down. Just my opinion, and I haven't seen a compelling argument against it. Maybe if those that are in the position to do it would actually follow through, then I would believe it.
    
    Mel

    
    Melvin H. Waldron III, CGCS, Horton Smith Golf Course, City of Springfield/Greene County MO
    
    
21. McCallum David K

    
    5/26/2012 10:05 AM

    Mel from the article I read about the Maryland govenor and legislature the number of 100k and 150k was "picked" by them to be the threshold for one to be considered rich. Again $150 for a couple is not that outrageous in these times. If my wife stil worked as OR or ER nurse as she once did with the overtime she made we would be way over that threshold. But shes an 8-5 nurse in a private practice of 6 doctors making much less than she did then but home on weekends and NO stress. Only my opinion but I think the number is stupid even if it computes out to $125 annually or not.

    
    
    
    
22. Wahlin Scott B

    
    5/26/2012 12:05 PM

    David McCallum said: Mel from the article I read about the Maryland govenor and legislature the number of 100k and 150k was "picked" by them to be the threshold for one to be considered rich. Again $150 for a couple is not that outrageous in these times. If my wife stil worked as OR or ER nurse as she once did with the overtime she made we would be way over that threshold. But shes an 8-5 nurse in a private practice of 6 doctors making much less than she did then but home on weekends and NO stress. Only my opinion but I think the number is stupid even if it coputes out to $125 annually or not.

    
    
    Making an issue out of raising a $100M+ person's taxes by 0.0025x is stupid. Go sniff flowers.

    
    
    
    
23. Sandy Clark

    

    0 posts
    
    5/29/2012 10:05 AM

    It isn't the amount that is in question the problem is why does the government need it at all? Clean up all waste, corruption, duplication and unnecessary expenditures before asking me for another dime. I dare say
    Scott, you and I disagree on most things political but I bet the two of us could sit down over time and clean up the budget even with our disagreements. I say that because all supers have the same responsibility which is properly manage our owners investment and be frugal with all expenditures. Until the will to do the same is shown by our politicians, the answer will always be to ask for more of our money rather than properly manage the assets they have. When you suffer from OPM Syndrome (other peoples money), you just don't have the will or need to spend wisely. That needs to change with all politicians.

    
    
    
    
24. Dennis Cook

    

    1 posts
    
    5/29/2012 1:05 PM

    Mel,
    
    You say you need a middle class to support business, but you cant develop a middle class unless there are a lot of successful businesses that are making money so they can pay people to work. You lefties always make it out like the employee fuels the economy and thats total BS. Businesses fuel the economy and fuel this whole country. Without them no one has anyone to work for except themselves. Keep up the anti business mentality and this country will be ruined.

    
    
    
    
25. Melvin Waldron

    

    43 posts
    
    5/29/2012 3:05 PM

    Dennis Cook said: Mel,
    
    You say you need a middle class to support business, but you cant develop a middle class unless there are a lot of successful businesses that are making money so they can pay people to work. You lefties always make it out like the employee fuels the economy and thats total BS. Businesses fuel the economy and fuel this whole country. Without them no one has anyone to work for except themselves. Keep up the anti business mentality and this country will be ruined.

    
    
    Dennis didn't you read what I said above? Both businesses and a middle class are what is needed for the economy to recover. What the heck good is a business if no one can afford to buy their product? Look at the golf business for the last few years as a good example. Although play has been up this past year and weather has played a part in it, I would also say some of the new private sector job growth has played a part as well. Before when people were losing jobs left and right golf was suffering too. How about if we all don't shop at (pick your store) tomorrow, and just see how well that business does without customers. Businesses only fuel the economy? Now that is a big load of Bear Soap. I look at it as the chicken and egg thing. Which comes first customers for a product or a product for customers, you need both.
    
    As far as being anti-business what have I said that says I'm so anti-business? Heck even this administration is giving tax breaks up the wazoo to employers for hiring people. The only anti-business thing (and it's how you look at it, and I don't think it is because it's not affecting most small businesses due to the number of employees) is the health care law. And also maybe some tax rate issues, but I have said if the numbers compute lower the rate and cutout the tax breaks.
    
    Mel

    
    Melvin H. Waldron III, CGCS, Horton Smith Golf Course, City of Springfield/Greene County MO
    
    
26. Melvin Waldron

    

    43 posts
    
    5/29/2012 4:05 PM

    I have to admit, I have been anti-business when it comes to being careful as environmental concerns, as in the Keystone Pipeline. I just got home and was eating lunch with Hardball on in the background and they were talking about some Texas guy pumping bunches of money in to Gov. Romney's campaign hoping to get him elected so Romney would gut the EPA so this guy can build a nuclear waste facility on top of a large aquifer. I haven't researched it yet, but it did jog my memory. Just wanted to clarify that and admit my stance.
    
    Mel

    
    Melvin H. Waldron III, CGCS, Horton Smith Golf Course, City of Springfield/Greene County MO
    
    
27. McCallum David K

    
    5/30/2012 9:05 AM

    Do not know the particulars of the case you sighted Mel but I am pro business but against any fool no matter what his political affiliation if he wants to put a nuke waste site on top of any aquifer.........a no brain er to me.

    
    
    
    
28. Melvin Waldron

    

    43 posts
    
    5/30/2012 12:05 PM

    David McCallum said: Do not know the particulars of the case you sighted Mel but I am pro business but against any fool no matter what his political affiliation if he wants to put a nuke waste site on top of any aquifer.........a no brain er to me.

    
    
    Haven't looked it up myself yet either, it is something we can certainly agree on, I think most people on both sides of the aisle could agree with that one. Hopefully that helps with my point on Keystone, yeah I know millions of miles of pipelines, but I just prefer to be overly cautious, heck if they want to build it around that aquifer in Nebraska, I don't have a problem with it either. I feel like I can be pro business as long as business isn't taking advantage of the citizens and cause issues. Just like the drilling in the gulf, there was a mistake made, it was found how it happened, changes were put into place, now as I understand it there is more new drilling out there, nothing wrong with being cautious in my opinion.
    
    Mel

    
    Melvin H. Waldron III, CGCS, Horton Smith Golf Course, City of Springfield/Greene County MO
    
    
29. Dennis Cook

    

    1 posts
    
    5/31/2012 10:05 AM

    Melvin Waldron, CGCS said:

    Dennis Cook said: Mel,
    
    You say you need a middle class to support business, but you cant develop a middle class unless there are a lot of successful businesses that are making money so they can pay people to work. You lefties always make it out like the employee fuels the economy and thats total BS. Businesses fuel the economy and fuel this whole country. Without them no one has anyone to work for except themselves. Keep up the anti business mentality and this country will be ruined.

    
    
    Dennis didn't you read what I said above? Both businesses and a middle class are what is needed for the economy to recover. What the heck good is a business if no one can afford to buy their product? Look at the golf business for the last few years as a good example. Although play has been up this past year and weather has played a part in it, I would also say some of the new private sector job growth has played a part as well. Before when people were losing jobs left and right golf was suffering too. How about if we all don't shop at (pick your store) tomorrow, and just see how well that business does without customers. Businesses only fuel the economy? Now that is a big load of Bear Soap. I look at it as the chicken and egg thing. Which comes first customers for a product or a product for customers, you need both.
    
    As far as being anti-business what have I said that says I'm so anti-business? Heck even this administration is giving tax breaks up the wazoo to employers for hiring people. The only anti-business thing (and it's how you look at it, and I don't think it is because it's not affecting most small businesses due to the number of employees) is the health care law. And also maybe some tax rate issues, but I have said if the numbers compute lower the rate and cutout the tax breaks.
    
    Mel

    
    Maybe the health care law, oh and maybe some tax rate issues???!!!!!!!! Two huge anti business things Mel. Of course you have to have customers for business to survive, but how do those customers make their money? By working for a business that has a product or service that is in demand. You need businesses who provide things that are in demand in order for people to have jobs